Comments for Math plan doesn’t add up at http://tracypress.com , comment 1 to 49 out of 20 comments http://tracypress.com Sat, 22 Nov 2008 03:35:22 +0100 FeedCreator 1.7.2 http://tracypress.com/content/view/15238/2244/#comment-54134 J281gt: I read the CJ Penguin Classic collection back in high school. I think Jung was a product of his times, like his friend Freud (Frazier, too). Archetypes are all the Victorian fascination with anthropology rolled up in the form of a Freudian cigar. In general, psychology did not begin to achieve any level of scientific validity until the cognitive era (post-Chomsky's attack on Behavioralism), and is only recently beginning to merge with a truly mechanistic theory of brain to present a coherent picture of how mind works. So I would say that Jung was mostly wrong. Freud was mostly wrong. Skinner and Pavlov were partly wrong. EO Wilson was a bit overwrought. Witch burning was really wrong (that's a quick jab at Scott who is surely familiar with Thomas Szasz, as well read as he is!). But today, cognitive theory combined with evolutionary and developmental psychology, then cross-checked with solid neuroimaging, begins to achieve some level of mature science of mind and brain. - MarkDavis Fri, 18 Jul 2008 21:54:49 +0100 http://tracypress.com/content/view/15238/2244/#comment-54131 Mark, A little off subject here, but what is your take on the works of Carl Jung? Have you had the opportunity to read any of his publications? - Justin281gt Fri, 18 Jul 2008 21:25:49 +0100 http://tracypress.com/content/view/15238/2244/#comment-54092 Well, I blame Scott for leading this article off into the ether of religious craziness. I also can't understand nearly any of his counter-arguments because there are no counter-arguments just ad hominem attacks and rhetorical fallacies. Instead of responding to my original critique of two subordinate arguments to his original letter, he instead has not addressed any of those points. Instead, he has hared off in a rambling series of incoherent, poorly spelled, and often grammatically incorrect attempts to attack me and associate my claims with weird religious associations. He also has appealed to the masses, to emotion, and to various authors who he can't even correctly name. I also looked up his reference to a book that might be called "Quantum Learning" (his spelling was suspect, as usual). There are a number of books by that title, including a series of self-help books and, possibly, one volume called Quantum Learning & Instructional Leadership in Practice that mentions current issues in brain research. Fair enough, but I think that anyone who claims an understanding of developmental psychology would at the very least acknowledge Piaget's notion of magical thinking as the more correct interpretation of Santa Claus, faeries and proto-religious beliefs. And possibly even do it in a coherent fashion ;) - MarkDavis Fri, 18 Jul 2008 17:28:54 +0100 http://tracypress.com/content/view/15238/2244/#comment-54070 Thought so, too, just got caught up in Annie's post, found something in common there! A kindred in our beliefs! Math is an important application in life, tool! Pounds per square inch for the tires, when driving.... for example. Reading the instructions well were lacking, too! First, we need to get out of this national debt! We owe so much to China, Japan and UK. If China one day decide to visit and collect? Hope Not! Just feeling jittery with the direction our country is going. We are turning into an inferior nation, educationally, poor math skills, reading skills, comprehension, abstract thinking skills, and communication skills, leading to inferior jobs. If we had not been so busy "policing" the world, we would have more funds to hire more quality teachers who would make Math fun to the point the students would embrace challenges in facing new Math, Algebra! Thanks. -amy - amy Fri, 18 Jul 2008 15:22:24 +0100 http://tracypress.com/content/view/15238/2244/#comment-54068 Could we get off the religion discussion. It is way off the topic of this letter. We have gone astray. Let's stick to Algebra, our 8th graders and the school system. - mactrew5 Fri, 18 Jul 2008 14:56:36 +0100 http://tracypress.com/content/view/15238/2244/#comment-54052 Meaning no disrespect to the article, but finding the discussion very interesting, thanks! -amy - amy Fri, 18 Jul 2008 14:04:28 +0100 http://tracypress.com/content/view/15238/2244/#comment-54051 I had thought along that same subject in the past, noticed that every leader tries to justify their inhumanity on "In the Name of God" as if God actually spoke to them to carry it out. In a sense, I don't think He is anything like that. Leaders sometimes uses the word "God" knowing there are many believers out there, who can dispute one with "authority of God". That is where I have problems with. Radical Muslims using Allah to justify blowing themselves up... does the true Allah really want to see his own creation blown up? Taking control of such situation spells man's arrogance... by using the word God/Yahweh/Allah/Jehovah, what ever other names He has world over to justify their political gain. (taking over land, water and so on in the Biblical past). So much easier to "lead" people who are believers in the "Name of God" to justify inhumanity? -amy - amy Fri, 18 Jul 2008 14:02:33 +0100 http://tracypress.com/content/view/15238/2244/#comment-54041 Annie, I disagree with your view of God not punishing humanity. There are a plethora of scriptures, especially in the Old Testament, that specifically show that God does indeed punish us and quite frequently. Many innocent Israelite men, women, and children were butchered by the Assyrians and Babylonians as punishment from God when Israel was conquered. Keep in mind this was after he had selected The Israelites as his “chosen people”. Could all of them really have really been that bad? Women and children? After all, God had promised to “show favor” to these people. Further examples of this sort of punishment concept can be found in many of the books of the prophets such as Isaiah, Hosea, Amos, etc. I think the story of punishment that I really find most problematic is the story of Job. We are all pretty much vaguely familiar with this particular story, but how many people really stop and think that, any way you want to cut it, Job was punished for no reason other than a callous celestial wager. Even the whole New Testament concept of Jesus being crucified was, in effect, to "scapegoat" all of humanities impending punishment. As much as I have tried in my lifetime I have yet to come across any suggested explanation that justifies this sort of cruel behavior from a deity who is supposed to “Love his children” and allegedly endorses “forgiveness”, but believe me I really have tried. I am to the point now that when I look at scripture all I can see is a very human book filled with contradictions and various other inaccuracies. All that being said, again, I am glad you find comfort in your faith. As they say, "To each his own". Thank you for responding. - Justin281gt Fri, 18 Jul 2008 13:26:53 +0100 http://tracypress.com/content/view/15238/2244/#comment-54038 Just wished we have robust economy to hire great teachers who would make learning math fun and more receptive to algebra! -amy - amy Fri, 18 Jul 2008 13:04:17 +0100 http://tracypress.com/content/view/15238/2244/#comment-54037 I am also mindful that all text, written materials were written by word of man on the subject of religion, too. Pro or cons. -amy - amy Fri, 18 Jul 2008 13:02:50 +0100 http://tracypress.com/content/view/15238/2244/#comment-54034 I think most middle schools in Tracy offer algebra. It is not required, but it is offered. My two oldest were not offered algebra in 8th grade. Now their school offers it and my youngest will be able to take it. I never was taught that God knew the future. I was taught that we have free will. He created us with a purpose, but it is up to us to fulfill that purpose. If we make bad choices then we will not get to go to heaven. God does not punish us, but He does not protect us from ourselves. Justin, some of your questions were things I have asked myself and the religious staff at my church. As a child I felt that the world was so unjust. I don't have an answer as to why children suffer. I know it will be revealed to me when I am ready. - Annie Snyder Fri, 18 Jul 2008 12:45:16 +0100 http://tracypress.com/content/view/15238/2244/#comment-54033 Yes, everyone has their own belief they understand best. -amy - amy Fri, 18 Jul 2008 12:42:26 +0100 http://tracypress.com/content/view/15238/2244/#comment-54027 Amy, That's a very insightful perspective. Thank you for sharing. I'm not sure if I can vouch for the whole idea of "free will" in man. This is what troubles me, and it is discussed in the book Atheism: The Case Against God by George H. Smith, If you honestly believe God is omniscient, i.e. knows everything past, present, and future how can that be reconciled with the idea of free will in man? Put simply, if God already knows the future with infallible certainty than the future is predetermined and man is impotent to change it. He would already know who is going to heaven or hell, etc. Anyway, just some food for thought. Back to the subject at hand. - Justin281gt Fri, 18 Jul 2008 12:08:50 +0100 http://tracypress.com/content/view/15238/2244/#comment-54009 Another money saving tip...Change the school calendar. Who sets that up anyway? STUPID. The school year should start the end of August or better yet after Labor Day. Like we all used to. Then get out the middle of June. Most of the time we do not need the air conditioning in June. We definitely need it in August. Two weeks of not having to run the air alone would save a lot of money. Also what about mini Mondays? Take them out alltogether. The children go the school full day on Monday's. Add the difference in hours up and have a couple more full days off during the year. Again a simple save in energy costs could go a long way. - mactrew5 Fri, 18 Jul 2008 10:31:51 +0100 http://tracypress.com/content/view/15238/2244/#comment-54008 Back to the article, we do have shortage of math teachers! ;) -amy - amy Fri, 18 Jul 2008 10:28:39 +0100 http://tracypress.com/content/view/15238/2244/#comment-54007 In many other countries around the world the children learn from a curriculum that far out weighs ours. How come their kids can get through it and not ours? I believe we have a school system that needs an overhaul. We actually need to start teaching some things at an earlier age. Language for example should not wait until middle school and/or high school. That is something that young children should start beacuse they are able to soak it in like sponges. A school district in Massachusettes realizes that in the fulture China will be one of the top economic powers. So they are now teaching their kids Chinese (not sure what dialect) starting kindergarten so when they are in middle school they are just about fluent. As far as math is concerned, we still can improve. I agree with teaching Algebra in 8th grade. However we need to build up to that by incorporating more math and math concepts a bit earlier so they are ready. The money concerns do not hold water with me beacause some kids are already taking Algebra in 8th grade and we pay to bus them over to the high schools for 1st period then back to their middle schools for the rest of the day. Why not just have it at the middle school already? One of the news shows did a piece on education around the world. In Belgium for example they have a stronger curriculum and their schools, like many European schools are run more like a business. If the teacher is not doing a good job, they are fired. This keeps them all running at a high level. The show gave SAT like tests to the Belgium students and to American students from a distinguished school. Guess what? The Belgium students scores were much higher. We can do better. We are underestimating the power of a young mind. The proof is in the pudding - if other countries can do it -why can't we? And by the way, where is the lottery money going? We need to overhaul that too. Set up a new contract with the lottery to get more $ for our schools. - mactrew5 Fri, 18 Jul 2008 10:24:39 +0100 http://tracypress.com/content/view/15238/2244/#comment-54006 I do understand what you are saying, Is corruption caused by God? I don't think so, man did. Were the wars caused by God? I don't think so, man did. A person speaks harshly to another breaking a person's spirit, was that of God? No. Again, man. Every person is responsible for their own action. Everyone of us has "free-will", how we use it is up us, for the good or for the bad? We only have our own choice in dealing with what is before us, not on worldly scale, God is on one to one relationship with each person when they let him. ("God never moves away from man, but man moves away from God") I chose the term God as the Omnipotent who knows all. Why were babies born deformed (caused by chemicals, DU, many factors, even genetics, that causes deformities? To increase our compassion? To reach out to hurting parents. There is a lesson in every case of why's I've learned. Many things are a blessing in disguise. I am human like everyone, I get mad, why?... it is time when I see injustice. It showed me the strength of my sense of justice. But when tired and hungry, I get cranky, too!;) Lots of "enlightenment" will come your way, seeing things how they really are, how you, yourself are and how , and go past that... like organized religion. Some people need structure in their lives, guided by the church teachings. I wonder what it is that about a Baptist Minister dancing with snakes in the church as shown on TV some time ago! Exploiting religion? I think so. Just my opinion. I just use the New Testament since I feel it contains the best advice given to us by Jesus. Good guide to live daily. Annie may have different story to tell you, this is my version of my own belief. Thanks. I just like knowing that I have God and Jesus at my side! When I feel Him speaking to be He first envelopes you with His extreme calmness and the soft silent words follow. For me "Evil" is when I intentionally make the wrong choices knowing it is not good for me or those around me. - amy Fri, 18 Jul 2008 10:24:07 +0100 http://tracypress.com/content/view/15238/2244/#comment-53999 Annie and Amy, I'm really not trying to rain on your parade but I am curious how you will respond. I grant that both of you feel you have experienced miracles and that these experiences have assembled themselves into cornerstones of your faith. What the average Christian fails to enter into the equation is the needless suffering that occurs each and everyday. Every few seconds innocent children are dying of hunger, by the time I finish typing this comment it is a safe assumption that somewhere in the world a little girl has been kidnapped and raped. Where are their miracles? Are they being punished for their sins (This is a common answer to the question of suffering throughout the Bible) If God is omniscient and omnipresent why would he not intervene? Human beings are all far from perfect but I suspect most of us, given the ability, would bring an end to this type of needless suffering and yet God does nothing. We are left with random unsubstantiated claims of miracles often proclaimed by folks with an agenda, of course yourselves withstanding as I truly believe both of you are genuine in your belief. I'll leave you with a quote that Epicurus once wisely penned: “Is [God] willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then is he impotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then is he malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Whence then is evil?" - Justin281gt Fri, 18 Jul 2008 09:19:01 +0100 http://tracypress.com/content/view/15238/2244/#comment-53997 Amen! Religion comes in handy when you need that human support, but I don't do church now. It did not fit me well and I felt sad and lonely there. I can talk to God anywhere, anytime. I can listen better when I am alone. - Annie Snyder Fri, 18 Jul 2008 09:08:43 +0100 http://tracypress.com/content/view/15238/2244/#comment-53984 You, too, Annie!!! I am not for organized religion either, but I do believe in God and Jesus. Man's word is not of God, but Word of God is God alone (speaking to you in your time of distress and giving you comfort) Jesus said that there is no man between us and God when it comes to worship. Meaning you can talk directly to God from your heart! (Not dictated by man) without the pomp of worship in organized religion. I think you get the gist of what I am saying, I sure do understand what you said!!! :) -amy - amy Fri, 18 Jul 2008 08:38:53 +0100